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Kenneth Reitz
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122 KiB
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[{"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015206.4408901, "message": "1) Background - 5 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265626}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015287.4226401, "message": "4) Use Cases - 10 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265633}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024758.470989, "message": "hhahahahhaha", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267382}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015193.5066071, "message": "The goal of today's discussion is to develop a proposal for versioning support in the core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265624}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015198.6489129, "message": "Our agenda:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265625}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016115.3724749, "message": "Brendan's going to be a bit late I believe", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265675}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016124.0297539, "message": "hey craig, is it ok if I join you for the meeting?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265676}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016132.5196321, "message": "of course!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265677}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016207.9766951, "message": "I'm still around though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265687}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017214.644362, "message": "back", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265773}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015216.8433101, "message": "2) Scope - 10 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265627}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015228.590826, "message": "3) Goals - 10 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265629}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015312.226757, "message": "6) Next Steps - 10 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265635}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016244.062464, "message": "Convore is always giving me problems", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265692}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016250.539721, "message": "Yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265694}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016959.114799, "message": "For starters, in my opinion we need to support entry versioning in the core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265748}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017005.4287629, "message": "and make sure it's very well supported", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265753}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307015297.0205679, "message": "5) Proposals - 15 mins", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265634}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016140.6502371, "message": "Thanks :)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265678}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016270.686703, "message": "allen, that makes me think of this:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265696}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017742.4947951, "message": "same here", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265862}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017743.6591959, "message": "or deleting an entry", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265863}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018121.1592751, "message": "but we're talking about blank slate", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265908}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016271.494348, "message": "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXqkNF8fgs8", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265697}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017737.263109, "message": "I don't see why developer stuff should be versioned, although I agree we shouldn't prevent it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265861}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018258.5653141, "message": "should it be possible to undo a restore?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265944}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016159.7216959, "message": "Hi Allen", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265681}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016204.2162831, "message": "Sorry guys, my dad just called.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265684}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016371.8993449, "message": "give me sec, installing nodejs on my server...", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265709}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016595.2657211, "message": ":)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265720}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016106.6447189, "message": "Hey guys", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265674}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016153.3742371, "message": "Hi", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265679}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016207.579025, "message": "Convore seems to be having connection issues", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265686}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017057.3967969, "message": "so part of this discussion needs to be around exactly how we do that so that our versioning support is robust and flexible", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265760}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017157.2506299, "message": "second, I'd like the admin UI to have universal \"Undo\" functionality", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265768}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017421.67767, "message": "shall we talk about that first?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265810}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016587.7880499, "message": "Hmm, I hate convore", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265719}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016620.6241241, "message": "ah, I am still receiving your messages, just nobody talking, I see", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265722}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016762.336478, "message": "@allen and @buzzomatic, just shout when you're back", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265727}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016940.2754259, "message": "Well the background is this...", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265746}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017028.8268991, "message": "anyway, idea being that it should be on our agenda as we move forward", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265756}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017329.88311, "message": "if so, my thought would be that's something git is good at offering", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265787}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017370.521955, "message": "cool, so since everything else is file-based except for versions, we can count that out", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265792}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017375.6172769, "message": "i mean entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265795}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017378.9944811, "message": "sorry, I'm tired", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265797}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017649.592356, "message": "or entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265847}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017743.979563, "message": "does nicks extension cover that?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265864}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017772.016866, "message": "I think Nick's extension only deals with entry version change", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265867}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017775.9722669, "message": "not all developer stuff at this moment is file based", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265869}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018158.874018, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265916}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016889.9491529, "message": "Start, I'm just waiting on scripts to run", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265738}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017087.6066611, "message": "which fall under \"scope\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265765}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017302.1201711, "message": "we're talking about file versioning?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265783}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017650.5039899, "message": "this way, when a user 'undo' an action, a system alert can pop up", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265848}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017661.3965449, "message": "hm, right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265850}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018344.8906119, "message": "or else something like the duplicator would have to keep track of every user action", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265961}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017294.714056, "message": "My thought on supporting versioning for templates/xslt", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265782}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019448.7483411, "message": "they are nearly identical, arent they>", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266157}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019636.9800129, "message": "At this moment, I believe both the versioning and the undo function should be in the core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266219}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020007.7272739, "message": "still, to be honest, I feel this should be a core feature", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266303}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016989.429162, "message": "what is the reason for not having this as a seperate extension?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265751}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307016994.911144, "message": "or if we do it via extension, we plan it from the get-go", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265752}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017015.8875639, "message": "makes sense", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265755}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017082.3539939, "message": "before we get there, though, I want to raise two other questions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265763}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017132.0395889, "message": "first, is there scope for supporting versioning for other things, like view templates or xslt utilities?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265767}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017179.752995, "message": "that would be sweet, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265771}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017324.4490471, "message": "how many steps back would undo cover?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265785}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017328.0922711, "message": "just one?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265786}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017380.2251329, "message": "I like the idea of 'undo', if we're talking about UI control type of undo and not in terms of textarea/form undo (since that's offered by the browser itself)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265799}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017400.101136, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265801}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017401.888417, "message": "Yes, like you delete a data source, then you can undo that action", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265802}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017408.712923, "message": "that would be really useful", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265804}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017410.551441, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265805}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017442.5715361, "message": "So what happens if a user navigates out of the page", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265815}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017477.997386, "message": "I have an idae", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265823}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017446.6034341, "message": "are they still able to undo?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265817}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017518.2183671, "message": "sort of like photoshop history I guess", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265830}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017540.678443, "message": "the way this could work would be all actions are logged when a form submission is triggered", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265832}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017621.3467939, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265842}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017670.1022611, "message": "How can the system make Nicks extension work better, what short comings has Nick found?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265851}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019103.283865, "message": "with allen, tha tis", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266095}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017696.873508, "message": "well, we're talking about actions like deleting a DS though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265854}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017731.8941281, "message": "so the issue Huib mentioned stands", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265860}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017781.1499519, "message": "if you delete an entry, it's gone along with all the version data", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265871}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017885.884444, "message": "@czheng do what extent were you envisaging with the 'universal' undo?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265881}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018104.623764, "message": "I wonder if something like this would cause issues with extensions like SSM", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265905}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017465.2017601, "message": "or is the datasource taken to the trash folder", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265818}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017474.6671071, "message": "actually", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265821}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018165.7372899, "message": "If we are only dealing with deletes, I think we should create a junk folder", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265917}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018294.827673, "message": "good point, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265950}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018606.703732, "message": "(even though you clicked confirm)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265994}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020048.6947899, "message": "ok so another option:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266317}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020064.236625, "message": "entry versioning is an extension, but UI Undo is a core feature", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266322}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017468.8067861, "message": "where it can be restored later on", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265819}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017485.7238381, "message": "all actions are logged in a queue", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265824}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018668.3036611, "message": "so if you delete a ds", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266007}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017503.8061841, "message": "and you're able to restore fromt the queue", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265827}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017614.2566149, "message": "alongside a snapshot of the item before change?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265839}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017620.6685801, "message": "this would be nearly identical to the way Nicks extension works, right?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265841}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017699.91787, "message": "at least I was", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265855}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018188.787389, "message": "yeah if we limit the scope, then all we're talking about is logging objects as they're deleted", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265921}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018214.729362, "message": "so cascading delete just means logging all the deletes, although they may need to be bundled", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265928}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018229.739028, "message": "the junk folder idea is easy enough if all it is is just a checkbox to note that the item is in the trash. No need to actually delete the entry", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265932}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018232.093267, "message": "so that restoring one restores the ones it depends on, or whatever", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265935}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018286.7788341, "message": "technically 'restoring' would delete the existing version?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265949}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018308.650645, "message": "So should this queue logging happen inbetween user actions? Or just when they edit/save/delete?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265953}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018628.9229541, "message": "yup", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266001}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019078.438422, "message": "I agree, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266090}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017649.318187, "message": "this could give serious problems if the entry is dependend on other fields", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265846}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017719.5766511, "message": "removing a field in a section would fall in the same category", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265857}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017786.5557389, "message": "yes, that's what I think", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265872}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018032.9057021, "message": "yes, I like the gmail's undo", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265896}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018138.0173061, "message": "well, I mean more about issues of cascading delete", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265909}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018193.6621079, "message": "yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265923}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018589.1694341, "message": "or a view", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265988}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018965.8562341, "message": "undo takes care of deletions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266058}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019192.2518499, "message": "hehe", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266114}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019600.7467699, "message": "so here are two options:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266202}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018207.9931669, "message": "I believe this is the way gmail does it, too?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265926}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018245.7077079, "message": "oh yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265941}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018611.8035369, "message": "yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265996}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018623.2275219, "message": "but so on the index page an alert could appear with the 'undo?' action", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265999}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017906.9836459, "message": "By the way, even if every bit of symphony would be file based, I still feel that since we provide a UI for managing those bits, we should still provide versioning for the people that do use the GUI instead of GIT", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265885}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307017998.740438, "message": "@allen User-focused goal. Whether someone's a developer or not, it's possible they could end up doing something they regret and want to undo that action. Less pressing for small changes that can be easily undone by hand, but at least for delete we need a system-wide option", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265890}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018022.2734129, "message": "So something like gmail's undo", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265892}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018050.727886, "message": "i mean, yeah, like pretty much any web app these days", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265898}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018263.5490179, "message": "lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265945}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018270.3837941, "message": "I guess so", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265946}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018478.1147339, "message": "so, to recap:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265972}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018567.784605, "message": "depends on whether our goal is to make everything undo-able or only that which is presently not reversible", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265983}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018595.3926959, "message": "then realize you didn't mean to", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265992}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019152.6654601, "message": "Make up your mind Huib ;)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266107}, {"user_id": 23042, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019160.376169, "message": "delete == data is missing but still found in log", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266109}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019215.366111, "message": "I think the Javascript confirm is enough to prevent 'oops I deleted it'", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266118}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019300.7783639, "message": "okay, we're all on the same page wrt log queue system", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266136}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019886.9880509, "message": "I wouldn't need it if my Symphony build is being used as an XML response server akin to what we built for MTV", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266268}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019935.3866479, "message": "I don't need the file upload fields in some of my projects, but still it is a core field", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266285}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020038.0138979, "message": "so essentially you could have a Symphony build with one data source type, event type and one field. or none at all", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266313}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020126.08869, "message": "agree here", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266340}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020610.017652, "message": "For your own version control workflow", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266466}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018094.6988299, "message": "maybe let's limit the scope of \"undo\" to deletions for now?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265904}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018151.432122, "message": "so relationships", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265913}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018478.384361, "message": "cool, ok", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265973}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018581.3665199, "message": "deletion of anything", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265985}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018631.695118, "message": "similar to gmail like has already been said", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266002}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018723.4160869, "message": "yes, this is my understanding", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266016}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018789.612848, "message": "yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266028}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018954.44045, "message": "versioning takes care of editorial changes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266054}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019128.99036, "message": "So potentially an 'Undo' may be a collection of things to do", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266102}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019115.630549, "message": "no, craig", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266099}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019291.299228, "message": "hahaa", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266133}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018189.500366, "message": "I often delete something and only find out I shouldn't ahve deleted it a few hours later", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265922}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018344.655432, "message": "yes, just when the users saves/edits or deletes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265960}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018448.793057, "message": "Do we dig into the technical aspects of this or just pen it as a direction going forward would sufice", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265968}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018964.1348341, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266057}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019192.495383, "message": "haha", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266115}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019571.050853, "message": "If we're talking about how Nick's extension works as is now, then they're complementary since his extension doesn't deal with deletion", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266191}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019585.9828949, "message": "but you guys don't agree that undo should only cover deletions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266197}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019647.4396131, "message": "2) both versioning and undo rolled together and baked into core system-wide", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266222}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020151.895472, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266348}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020982.6269939, "message": "> Yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266576}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021001.5498459, "message": "no, you can't format c: if you are still running the operating system..;)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266581}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018330.8723409, "message": "I hope just when user edit/save/delete", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265957}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018424.3199821, "message": "Okay, so to what extent should we discuss this for the purpose of this meeting?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265967}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018574.08149, "message": "What's an example of when UI Undo would happen?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265984}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018924.321965, "message": "Users writing entries and/or deleting entries will certainly appreciate it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266049}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019076.5236051, "message": "If every save action adds it into the queue, for real versioning, there should be no reason why you can't rollback to it?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266088}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019185.4569769, "message": "I agree with Craig, i'm confused about who's agreeing to what and what we're actually agreeing to", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266112}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018946.978415, "message": "I think it's a complement to entry versioning in that context", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266052}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018469.8564451, "message": "Well I think we need to agree on an overall approach", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265970}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018518.971772, "message": "for the \"UI Undo\", we need to decide whether we're limiting the scope to deletes only or also including creates/edits", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265977}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018585.9389131, "message": "you delete a DS", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1265986}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018656.5448711, "message": "And that history is just a one off", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266005}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018668.939424, "message": "then go in a delete another", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266008}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018672.740597, "message": "undo would only revert the last one", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266009}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018691.0742531, "message": "if you wanted to get the 2nd deleted one back you'd go into your 'junk/trash/recycle bin' and restore it from there?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266012}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018816.9572041, "message": "could theoretically queue undos like the old S3 notifications system did, but yeah in principle that's right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266032}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018879.0267861, "message": "Personally, I don't think I would find the feature too useful for my own use, but others might", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266043}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307018986.2765779, "message": "sounds like we're all agreed that Undo should only cover deletes, yes?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266064}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019249.088412, "message": "confirm messages aren't always effective", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266123}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019333.4423659, "message": "what about scope though? if we're going beyond just deletes, this infringes on versioning territory", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266143}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020198.2653921, "message": "does that sounds agreeable to everyone?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266365}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020325.0059841, "message": "okay, we're all on different pages here then", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266393}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020558.823427, "message": "Heh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266453}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020649.2535999, "message": "if we implement undo, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266476}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021581.8813379, "message": "But if it was in the core, then these unversionable fields may have a versioning API to interact with", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266689}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021850.630331, "message": "Relationships are tricky", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266757}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022094.772408, "message": "if you delete entry 24 while it is linked to the original entry", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266835}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022252.8941331, "message": "hmm.. that wouldn't really change anything about the version of the actual entry..", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266845}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019050.684593, "message": "I largely agree with Allen, but I think it could also cover edits", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266082}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019183.0635459, "message": "I agree with Allen that I personally would rarely use this feature at all for anything but Entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266111}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019234.570441, "message": "but sure, some people will find it useful", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266122}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019305.8408639, "message": "I agree with craig here, people will not read and click \"ok delete\" anyway", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266138}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019494.498929, "message": "@Huib sorta, Undo implies you could just keep the last action, versioning implies you can rollback going back and forth between", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266171}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019537.5460269, "message": "maybe it should be in the core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266185}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020639.7143199, "message": "well lets remove them then", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266470}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020674.5591071, "message": "(ds, events, sections, authors)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266479}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020328.4478691, "message": "I just think undo is useless", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266394}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020361.955862, "message": "I don't see value", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266401}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020510.230983, "message": "eh, I don't know, if your developing a site and you click 'delete' and then just blaze through the confirm message... well I'd hate to have them on my team", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266436}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019163.342294, "message": "I don't understand who's agreeing with what", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266110}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019313.9954801, "message": "haha, another confirm message ;)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266139}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019525.266665, "message": "right... if there's to be a entry versioning extension, how does the \"undo\" functionality interact with that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266179}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019590.3839481, "message": "or so I thought...", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266198}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019750.7875249, "message": "ah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266243}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019804.6537781, "message": "i was going to say that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266251}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019887.441458, "message": "brendan doesn't make mistakes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266270}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020012.938971, "message": "Data sources types like section data source or dynamic data source are all extensions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266306}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020113.05322, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266335}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020251.679986, "message": "FWIW, I'd disable it too.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266373}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020261.456876, "message": "versioning or undo?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266376}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020491.3434391, "message": "Entry versioning 100% yes, in the core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266431}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020615.5729361, "message": "@czheng which is why we have a confirm...", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266467}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020853.9324419, "message": "(or take \"we\" out of that)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266529}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020857.7547951, "message": "We haven't really come to a concensus?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266531}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019256.439539, "message": "people tend to just click them", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266124}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019644.3195601, "message": "Could this not already been done with Pre/Post delegates?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266221}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019649.0556719, "message": "similar to Tracker?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266223}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019679.9176559, "message": "my vote would be 2", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266229}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019818.0165169, "message": "I could see that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266255}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019262.6273921, "message": "If someone clicks the 'undo' link, it'll just respond with, \"dude, I told you so but you clicked confirmed\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266127}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019269.3624411, "message": "heh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266129}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019748.044234, "message": "\"this versioning method sucks, I want to roll my own\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266242}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019797.4731879, "message": "unless of course people don't want the cruft of versioning logic in their system", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266249}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019800.996069, "message": "yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266250}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019810.789664, "message": "many might choose to disable it entirely", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266254}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019906.0582931, "message": "No he makes miracles. The opposite of mistakes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266276}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019943.7947969, "message": "ok so if it's an extension... two separate ones that interact, or versioning/undo bundled together into one extension?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266286}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019957.760762, "message": "@Huib not in the next version it's not", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266290}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020126.7201099, "message": "which may or may not exist", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266341}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019825.6390159, "message": "that, and I feel like billing the development of such an extension to a client is very hard", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266256}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019966.6863661, "message": "Actually Huib, all fields in the next version are optional", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266293}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020096.097898, "message": "This is a lot more complicated than I thought it would be.. lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266330}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020635.33495, "message": "if entry versioning goes into core, it cannot be replaced or removed. are we ok with that?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266469}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021058.601064, "message": "Like when I used to have to send mailshots out to several million people. You *always* double and triple check the email before hitting the send button", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266598}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021062.8353889, "message": "I think it's more about engineering effort", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266599}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019842.8782151, "message": "why would you disable it?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266259}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020095.4448841, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266329}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020278.0038781, "message": "I think versioning should be core, undo should be an extension", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266383}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020286.7604811, "message": "Nick! You're here", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266386}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020552.063606, "message": "and by sabing you mean, \"stabbing\" right?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266450}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020647.760329, "message": "I think we should, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266475}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020818.7145071, "message": "So as a developer you can reocver it by looking at the file system", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266517}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019447.872992, "message": "So the question is whether versioning should be offered by the core or by extensions as is now?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266156}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019566.9910719, "message": "because it will greatly impact the \"feel\" of the system", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266189}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019771.768007, "message": "If there's clearly one good way to do this, then there's no need for the concept of extensions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266246}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019866.756465, "message": "I'd disable it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266264}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019911.3756289, "message": "lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266279}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020754.0349989, "message": "I'm not convinced we need versioning on non-entry items, but I think we should be able to undo deletions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266502}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019609.4470601, "message": "I might be confusing things", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266207}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019631.9732721, "message": "1) two extensions, entry versioning and undo, that are complementary but don't touch the same things", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266217}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019909.6566761, "message": "lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266277}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020119.603981, "message": "otherwise it'll have to account for entry versioning extension", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266338}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020414.0146649, "message": "But surely it's good practice from our perspective to \"strongly suggest\" people use version control", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266415}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019704.5530641, "message": "Is there ever a need of two different types of versioning implementations?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266233}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019742.475903, "message": "what do you mean?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266241}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019904.262152, "message": "I think it should be an extension personally", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266275}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020361.2018631, "message": "(Yes sorry for being late, had a long meeting)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266400}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020398.7814541, "message": "Entry versioning I'm all for, undo just seems superfluous", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266410}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019952.8989151, "message": "True, but we're trying to keep Symphony lean", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266289}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019964.439734, "message": "So those cases should be minimal", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266291}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019978.418597, "message": "ok, didn't know that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266295}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307019920.371871, "message": "there is a differnce between not needing and disabling", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266282}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020147.8892789, "message": "so the core would implement a trash folder and an undo feature, then", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266345}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020526.961185, "message": "not all developers are on your team", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266441}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020695.9471779, "message": "deleting a section deletes all entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266483}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020721.8592579, "message": "and not all people use git for all projects", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266492}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020723.3851731, "message": "so a mistake is easily made", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266493}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020435.4369049, "message": "@nickdunn I think the argument is those situations between commits", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266419}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020596.162915, "message": "Sections, Datasources, Events, Views should be left for an extension", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266464}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020046.5115719, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266315}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020105.5450611, "message": "I think if they're to be separate though, then undo can only touch deletions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266333}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020190.0570121, "message": "yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266364}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020258.65784, "message": "which?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266375}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020274.1611631, "message": "Ha, both. But moreso undo", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266382}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020282.368232, "message": "lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266384}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020580.642441, "message": "you can undo a create by deleting it. you can undo an edit by reediting. but you cannot undo a delete. of anything.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266459}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020569.3305371, "message": "@Huib Entries or Datasources?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266456}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021072.7111909, "message": "assume some responsibility lies with the user", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266600}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021739.282021, "message": "or does rolling back to an earlier version roll the section back as well?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266732}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020018.850764, "message": "think about this: we are offering a GUI, so it better be a good gui", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266308}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020401.1473711, "message": "wouldn't this also mean we need an entry junk fodler?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266412}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020402.7859399, "message": "folder*", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266413}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020455.8064301, "message": "I'm on the same camp with Brendan and Nick. But I wonder if we're being a little on the elitist side and can't see what the fuss is. I do think entry versioning and undo is useful.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266422}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020640.6460149, "message": "So should we remove confirms?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266471}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020167.6663589, "message": "and the extension might cover multiple versions of the same entry", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266356}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020263.0946391, "message": "entry versions? or undo?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266377}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020267.916626, "message": "too late..:(", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266380}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020328.6577561, "message": "I personally see little or no value in structural undos to be honest (data sources etc). Seems like over-complication for little reward. I don't think I've ever had the need to undo creating, editing or deleting a data source, for example", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266395}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020329.251061, "message": "(and could be done with Pre/Post delegates no better then what the core could do anyway)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266396}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020345.573195, "message": "But if others see value, that's cool", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266398}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020372.8899851, "message": "Those sort of things are touched by developers, not Authors", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266405}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020384.906558, "message": "not all developers are created equal", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266408}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020433.5233819, "message": "Just as Symphony doesn't create backups of itself, it's down to people to assert their own backup strategy", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266418}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020483.8334, "message": "I just don't like the idea that there are irreversible actions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266428}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020520.7448499, "message": "doesn't matter", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266438}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020528.445399, "message": "But the web is stateless. An Undo is as simple as reloading the page without sabing", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266442}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020550.1650009, "message": "quite often I receive an angry email saying: \"I accidentely removed ..\" can you get it back?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266448}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020583.0345359, "message": "Yeah, entries we are saying should be core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266460}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020484.35093, "message": "Let me explain why I feel this should be in the core:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266429}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020570.7161491, "message": "Are we talking about things like deleting sections and fields, or entries?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266457}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020572.5047259, "message": "entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266458}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020662.1522019, "message": "I just want to clarify: I see value in version control for *entries*, and even an undo for *entries* to restore them. But I see absolutely zero in versioning/undo for anuything else", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266477}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020703.630091, "message": "well, we create a GUI for the editing of datasources, events, sections", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266487}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020629.5117509, "message": "confirms never work", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266468}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020810.314625, "message": "What about a level simpler, no UI to recover files, but if you delete a non-entry it simply archives it somewhere", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266514}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020810.4739821, "message": "I can live with having to undo my changes to a template", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266515}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021621.0177219, "message": "(moonoo2 can be an idiot, don't worry)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266697}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021751.5587671, "message": "wrt to the question of structural changes, that seems insurmountable to me.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266736}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022520.262146, "message": "Say a text field, db column", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266897}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022562.9898989, "message": "But in the same vein, you could also add a \"language\" column too", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266906}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022659.4498839, "message": "Kind of, yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266931}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022817.523119, "message": "IDK how'd that would affect performance", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266961}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022837.5195, "message": "I suppose you'd index that column though, so potentially it wouldn't be too horrible", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266965}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022895.929024, "message": "heh, I like the ghosts concept, but it's probably making it messy", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266976}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020909.8419161, "message": "well... I agree that entry versioning should be the priority here so I'm happy to table to Undo discussion", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266552}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020966.669636, "message": "Like typing \"c: format\" instead of \"d:format\"?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266570}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021221.512861, "message": "There are, yes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266626}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021400.3728721, "message": "@czheng oh, I thought you did the tracker extension", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266661}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020808.3289869, "message": "I'd argue deleting a section is a permanent delete that demands confirmation", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266508}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021639.6021571, "message": "Ok relationships is still technically an entry isn't it?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266698}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021701.315918, "message": "Wouldn't that depend on the nature of the relationship?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266722}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021923.442981, "message": "even if it was deleted in that other section", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266785}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022312.1344509, "message": "I feel like we'll run in circles", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266859}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022314.3246701, "message": "with the EV extension, the data stored in Symphony's tables, the canonical entry, is always the \"published\" version", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266861}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022527.6927781, "message": "id entry_id value", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266898}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022629.932353, "message": "this leads down that path of never deleting anything doesn't it!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266922}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022691.8248489, "message": "One row it could be \"1\" (version 1), another it might contain \"en\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266939}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022730.2729051, "message": "It means you couldn't version control languages", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266947}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023660.9199531, "message": "so you can still get to the data", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267139}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023801.7295389, "message": "I think language/publishing both hint at a more generic concept of 'states'", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267169}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023845.380971, "message": "I worry about baking too many of these things into core and introducing unnecessary inflexibilities", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267180}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023869.6198361, "message": "(bah don't you hate it when you release an extension then come back to it and hate the name because you have ideas that sorta relate to the extension but not the bloody name)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267183}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020810.025646, "message": "@craig: that is my point of view, too", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266512}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020839.1784101, "message": "I'd rather we focus on entry versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266523}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020902.385123, "message": "Isn't that what they're for?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266548}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020925.6674521, "message": "then I would click the yes button straigt away", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266561}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020933.526423, "message": "only to find out I deleted the wrong one too late", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266563}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020942.1030769, "message": "thanks craig, I was already looking for that..;)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266565}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020955.6382711, "message": "Isn't that the result of being careless?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266568}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020981.413815, "message": "\"Are you sure you want to format C:?\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266575}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020986.058018, "message": "Oh wait, I mean't D", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266577}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021002.121737, "message": "for the record, if you delete a email label, there is no undo for gmail", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266582}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021017.1961529, "message": "But you get my point", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266586}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021039.5247331, "message": "But if our goal is to provide a great user experience, we can't take this \"fuck you if you make mistakes\" attitude all the time.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266593}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021145.9781771, "message": "Agreed, I think versioning is a priority piece", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266610}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021158.195487, "message": "if it goes into core, it cannot be replaced or removed. are we ok with that?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266614}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021241.0402761, "message": "I think there are broadly three approaches that I have seen", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266629}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021270.444612, "message": "I think Nick and Craig are the authority in this matter since you both made one", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266633}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020916.493139, "message": "further reading: http://www.alistapart.com/articles/neveruseawarning/", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266557}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020988.5846751, "message": "Too late?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266578}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021124.202785, "message": "I'd rather make sure we've thought through entry versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266607}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021560.440356, "message": "unless we don't end up with limitations", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266684}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021741.168077, "message": "I'd get comment entries with a version created on or before the timestamp of article version 24", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266734}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021800.461303, "message": "Mimi and Allen are married. Mimi changed her work status. Allen changed his job title, then later undo the action. I wouldn't want my undo action to suddenly undo Mimi's work status", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266748}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022082.893523, "message": "what about this:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266832}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022951.4435201, "message": "With a \"current_version\" column, when you get an entry, you first get its ID from tbl_entries, check it's not deleted, then see what the version is. Then you can select its data for that version", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266984}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023049.3957019, "message": "@allen deleted? I never had one!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267010}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023172.24226, "message": "EV does this http://d.pr/WSZc", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267032}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023286.2361741, "message": "So if you delete a Title field, it;s still there for old entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267058}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023342.0404789, "message": "I'd say it doesn;t quite void them, but means they are incomplete", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267075}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023386.0867741, "message": "or it could just rollback the fields it has information for?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267085}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023458.059845, "message": "Does the structure and config of a section and its fields need to be versioned", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267101}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023496.664804, "message": "EV just takes the present field structure, if you view a much older version, it shows the present fields and populates what it can", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267107}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021197.443666, "message": "I'd like to know from others who's put more thought into this; is there a possibility of two different but equally good approach to versioning?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266621}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021857.4259419, "message": "lol", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266766}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022374.6769609, "message": "thanks for participating @huib", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266881}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022387.9647911, "message": "cheers huib", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266885}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022601.394201, "message": "Does that make sense? So when selecting entry data, you give an entry ID but also a version and/or a language", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266916}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020888.478637, "message": "I think confirmations never work.. They only work if you didn't intend to delete something in the first place", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266544}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021404.6635389, "message": "my bad", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266662}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021487.686558, "message": "- they do not manage inter-entry dependencies, so if a related entry changes, it is not cached along with the others (parent/child)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266671}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021666.3963189, "message": "So would it somehow have to trigger the versioning of the related Entries too", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266710}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021684.7598679, "message": "Yeah, something like that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266720}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021723.4179831, "message": "So how does Entry Versions at the moment handle Section changes?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266729}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021863.269619, "message": "if Version 1 is linked to Entry 24", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266767}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021921.9025011, "message": "Messy, huh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266784}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021932.6149111, "message": "it depends on if you can delete the entries from the entry you are worknig on", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266790}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022041.0577741, "message": "Wikipedia has it easy, because it's a single text blob, right?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266823}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307020914.3802149, "message": "if I had to delete a section because it was obsolete, but clicked the wrong one", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266554}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021036.7721779, "message": "If you're performing a destructive action, be double sure that you're doing the right thing", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266591}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021113.7891619, "message": "alright, let's table this piece of the discussion", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266605}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021316.2819741, "message": "I did no such thing", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266641}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021316.3140931, "message": "1. You version the steps to create the action. So DB Synchroniser tracks the SQL statements in order to replicate the change. Works well cross-build, but requires intervention to _reverse_ the action (i.e. an INSERT would need to log a corresponding DELETE)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266642}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021455.1775949, "message": "- if the field structure changes, your cached versions are dirty. E.g. if you change a field name, old versions (e.g. the cached XML) have the previous field name", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266668}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021469.6627049, "message": "@allen I did but Tracker just logs activities. No versioning.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266669}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021502.1508789, "message": "- they do not manage file versions (uploads)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266672}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021508.2272201, "message": "I'm done.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266673}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021535.426616, "message": "Ok so if we build this into core, we choose one approach and likely end up with a few key limitations", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266678}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021544.1644051, "message": "which seems to be an argument for not building it into core?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266680}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021579.3631229, "message": "Right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266687}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021605.4417081, "message": "sorry back, trying to figure out how {Member: Username element_name} can be made clearer =\\", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266693}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021646.9297161, "message": "(I gave him the answer 3 hours ago and he still hasn't realised)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266702}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021351.536449, "message": "2. Rowan's Audit Trail is much like Tracker, uses delegates to say what has been changed, where and when. Then it just keeps a dump of the object, so it can be instantiated again and restored. This allows entry recovery after deletion", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266646}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021413.7055261, "message": "3. My Entry Versions extension caches both the entry object (serlaised PHP object) *and* the built entry XML to disk. This means you can quickly instantiate old versions in the backend UI, to populate form fields (from the object), and easily render versions in DS by loading up the XML", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266664}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021423.5836909, "message": "The drawbacks of all:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266666}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021563.488245, "message": "A limitation has been that some fields are not versionable", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266685}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021680.558943, "message": "(and then if those entries have relationships they would be versioning as well)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266717}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021696.5506749, "message": "Unless versions are timestamped", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266721}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021729.4159219, "message": "are all versions before a section change removed?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266730}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021757.58972, "message": "There's nothing fancy, it doesn't listen to structural updates", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266739}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021887.4962111, "message": "but Version 3 is just linked to 50 because 24 and 45 have been deleted", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266777}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021933.6550801, "message": "@nickdunn definitely", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266792}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021948.6310091, "message": "But what if I went to the section that had Entry 24 in it and removed it?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266794}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022020.6069429, "message": "Most other CMS have versioning in some form or other", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266817}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022042.523514, "message": "specifically, ones that handle relationships?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266825}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021598.5321691, "message": "I'm talking specifically about file uploads and relationship fields", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266691}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021775.4048491, "message": "Yes, me too. I did have a long think about it for EV but never found a solution", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266743}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023031.2011249, "message": "Like writeboards in BC", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267002}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023207.0827811, "message": "Because the same archictecture could satisfy both, at the db level", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267038}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023251.3975551, "message": "> how does versioning work when I change the section structure", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267047}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023275.9059861, "message": "The nice thing about EV is that it stores the Entry object in a file on disk", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267055}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023445.9824419, "message": "Thing is, if you've deleted a field, should you still see that field if you roll back?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267097}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023612.613502, "message": "Perhaps after it rollbacks, if things couldn't be completed rollback the Alert system would kick in to say, \"This entry has been partially rolled back as the section's structure has changed since this version\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267130}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023637.4144609, "message": "Maybe that isn't even necessary", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267134}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023779.2284019, "message": "What was concluded from the lang chat?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267165}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023817.440037, "message": "I didn't think the language chat had happened?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267171}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024021.716876, "message": "The manifestation of the versions could be extensionised though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267211}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024051.128659, "message": "Another might expose version history as a field panel in the entry form", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267215}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024081.681555, "message": "You could have a Moderation extension that uses the version column in it's own table as a reference for what is the draft/moderated/published state", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267221}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021681.129405, "message": "and so on and so on", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266718}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022289.9430449, "message": "until we fully spec out the relationships and what they entail", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266854}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022331.594835, "message": "You can't create a newer version and have it as a draft", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266863}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022536.9657309, "message": "We could add an additional \"version\" column", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266900}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022716.9920709, "message": "I don't see the messiness", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266943}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022745.8265901, "message": "And yes, I could see what Brendan is talking about, not needing to delete entries at all really", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266950}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023035.5004101, "message": "@brend0 you deleted that? That's thing is super useful!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267004}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023074.822073, "message": "wait, I thought you guys made a big dataset for performance testing", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267013}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023088.4171879, "message": "Alistair did, our entry table had 500,000 entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267016}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023093.0800231, "message": "he took that with him though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267020}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023130.8976669, "message": "let's use Nick's", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267027}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023193.5438671, "message": "This might have already been asked, how does versioning work when I change the section structure?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267037}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023366.44734, "message": "So if you change the section structure, if versioning cannot roll back when you click on the link, you'd be prompted to download the entry as a XML file or something", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267080}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023658.008954, "message": "@brend0 that was my suggestion", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267137}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023744.9661181, "message": "For #2 I have _tried_ with an extension but was never able to, so I think something needs to be in the core at least", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267158}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021715.025157, "message": "So if I have version 24 of an Article, and I want to get comments", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266726}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021902.9738541, "message": "then I want to rollback to Version 1", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266781}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021904.5107491, "message": "I'd expect as a user that the relationship would roll back to Entry 24", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266782}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022861.925036, "message": "or the concept of a shadowing table", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266971}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022876.560612, "message": "so every section created has one table for 'real' entries, and another with ghosts in it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266974}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021852.3531621, "message": "Yeah relationships are a tricky beast.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266759}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021854.1623449, "message": "heh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266763}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021870.609035, "message": "and then Version 2 is linked to Entry 24, 45", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266773}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307021908.81669, "message": "yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266783}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022274.1658399, "message": "One of the features we're often asked to implement is the concept of versioning as well as draft/published/moderation states", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266848}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022305.7010291, "message": "Right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266858}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022340.7604129, "message": "@nick: good point", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266867}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022354.597796, "message": "Guys, it has been very interesting, but I have to leave..:(", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266873}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022371.5808499, "message": "It was just getting good!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266879}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022381.095638, "message": "thanks guys!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266882}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022383.0286341, "message": "Now this is where entry versioning and multilingual cross over", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266883}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022393.2976201, "message": "see ya huib!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266886}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022505.1352761, "message": "So my thinking, getting very into the implementation now, but...", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266895}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022007.9926741, "message": "is there any good examples of versioning in the wild?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266810}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022027.2871289, "message": "Wordpress added it as a core feature", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266821}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022049.7964039, "message": "yeah I assume so", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266827}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022254.5101731, "message": "EE: \"The Entry Versioning feature lets you save previous revisions of your weblog entries, so you never lose any edits you make.\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266846}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022276.367666, "message": "we're straddling two issues here: entry versioning and content relationships", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266849}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022331.935348, "message": "entry versioning needs only to respect the permissions and implications that the relationships dictate", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266864}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022364.5144939, "message": "Oh, shame", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266876}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022366.7062421, "message": "Indeed, because often you want to track who published it and when", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266877}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022791.5773151, "message": "I've read about software that does this before, but for the life of me I can't remember what", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266958}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022800.6353121, "message": "but yeah nothing was deleted, it's just flagged and ignored", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266959}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023027.1393969, "message": "ah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267001}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023598.41434, "message": "Yep", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267127}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022016.9037211, "message": "wikipedia", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266815}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022022.7361341, "message": "ist hat any good?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266819}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022025.429369, "message": "is that*", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266820}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022058.5377409, "message": "yeah", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266830}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022167.081531, "message": "and then, if you click back the original entry, it would display something like this in the top:\n\"this entry is linked to entry 24 which has been deleted. You can rollback the delete or remove the entry from the list\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266841}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022921.853251, "message": "or is it?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266981}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023723.284126, "message": "2. Do we want to deal with the concept of published state, draft/published/moderation", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267153}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023783.9927559, "message": "Or has it not happened?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267167}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024040.9799809, "message": "So he could have the audit trail (like tracker) that lists global operations", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267214}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024288.048739, "message": "Ok, works for me :)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267274}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025372.425221, "message": "feel free to whiteboard it in Basecamp or whatever", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267511}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022093.174619, "message": "I'd be impressed if undo exist for django as a framework feature", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266834}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022285.030556, "message": "Which adds another complication", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266851}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022324.639015, "message": "it's too hard to solve this particular problem without having the foundation already in place", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266862}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022353.8723519, "message": "Because the latest version is alwauys the one that's live", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266871}, {"user_id": 23184, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022385.1513801, "message": "see you around", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266884}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022424.8893161, "message": "For EV I had the idea that even the draft could be the latest entry. And whenever Symphony grabs its data, there's be delegates for me to swap the correct version in", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266888}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022429.481997, "message": "In the end that was far too complicated", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266889}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022478.5110149, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266891}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022622.0979199, "message": "oooh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266920}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022642.9053509, "message": "You could do this with delegates, sure, so that every time you request field data, an extension can intervene", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266925}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022649.848326, "message": "But if multilingual and versioning is core", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266928}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022676.265312, "message": "The \"version\" column could just be a generic \"flag\" column", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266938}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022752.4855909, "message": "Yes indeed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266952}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022812.1028969, "message": "Same. A lot of software does do this", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266960}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022844.8923681, "message": "I'd argue negligible so long as it was indexed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266966}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022985.4218171, "message": "My point about merging the version_number and language columns together was that structurally they're the same thing", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266989}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023008.4446671, "message": "If you choose to create a new version", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266996}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023019.3704579, "message": "EV extension ahs the option to make small edits without creating a new version", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267000}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023037.7475519, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267007}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023069.2282679, "message": "I think minor/major is a nice way to do it rather then just create a new version for every save", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267012}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023099.8389399, "message": "http://d.pr/Z3Yx", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267021}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022658.862818, "message": "right you're getting to it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266930}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022735.4421909, "message": "If it was a single column", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266948}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022761.468816, "message": "tbl_entries has a \"deleted\" flag set", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266955}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022830.923877, "message": "SSD for one", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266963}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022875.411227, "message": "so tbl_entries would also have a \"current_version\" or \"published_version\" column (or something)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266972}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022876.4172609, "message": "Also, it wouldn't be difficult to delete old entries if performance does become a problem", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266973}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022910.4243691, "message": "Row archiving was the other idea yeah. But figured an extra column would be simpler", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266979}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023006.335911, "message": "it's times like this where we need that 10,000 entry dataset to test ;)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266995}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023036.4773929, "message": "(I think)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267005}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023036.6269469, "message": "So does the concept of minor/major edits come into play", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267006}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023193.037266, "message": "I wasn;t a part of the multi-language chat. What was the conclusion?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267036}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023254.244478, "message": "In EV it does not", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267048}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022646.9681189, "message": "So does this mean baking versioning (and/or languages) into the core?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266927}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024082.745326, "message": "But baking it into the core would mean you get an extra System Version thing to filter by, for example", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267222}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024216.4005001, "message": "rather than the moderation extension be a middle man that has to interface with an entry every time its data is requested", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267261}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024326.961417, "message": "Hehe", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267279}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022696.004813, "message": "Perhaps that's too messy", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266940}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022837.061198, "message": "it doesn't delete anything", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266964}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023317.922298, "message": "that could be a graceful fallback", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267067}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023655.409652, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267136}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023677.413641, "message": "So a couple of questions:", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267143}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023900.6182411, "message": "A 'flag' column for the sake of versioning is a very elegant solution. The concept of versions can still be offered as an extension", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267187}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023918.9367819, "message": "different versioning implementations would still use the flag column to achieve their goal", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267189}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023923.1002359, "message": "albeit in their own way", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267191}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023960.7929809, "message": "Considering we only really have one versioning extension now (and even then it's rarely used), I wonder if we need to be generic enough to allow future versioning extensions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267196}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024001.3001101, "message": ";)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267205}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024129.8624229, "message": "Right?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267236}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024167.358012, "message": "So that's still kind of core \u2014 when fetching an entry that version number is checked", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267248}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024320.0996239, "message": "37 Signals' Signal versus Noise? Yes. Yes sir.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267278}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024349.6417429, "message": "So we haven't really touched on file versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267285}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024505.214751, "message": "If there is a versioning API, then extensions should use it to support their own data versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267323}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024566.746423, "message": "well, only for fields that need to deal with their own data/file set", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267336}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024587.9039669, "message": "yea", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267343}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024677.4525361, "message": "cull the fuckers", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267364}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023397.054409, "message": "hm", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267086}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023980.107373, "message": "if core provided versioning, I cannot imagine someone wanting to go write their own", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267199}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307022991.0304229, "message": "what if i have a simple entry with a title field and a 50,000 word text blob, and then I change the title 11 times. Do we store 11 copies of the 50,000 word blob?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1266990}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023868.3074491, "message": "sometimes people want to handle language on a field-by-field basis", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267182}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023140.2089851, "message": "disregard respect for privacy", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267029}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024547.219039, "message": "it adds an extra level of complexity and effort for field developers though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267328}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024767.9490581, "message": "It could remain dormant until an extension exposes it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267383}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024842.5306571, "message": "I'm hesitant in bundling the whole draft/pending/moderation/published states in by default because I can see half the clients at work would get confused and not need that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267401}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024881.228832, "message": "Or nigh impossible", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267414}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024972.044507, "message": "Cool", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267424}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025052.5945179, "message": "the things the system *needs* to be aware of should be baked in but not necessarily exposed, as Nick said", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267437}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025159.9418249, "message": "fml", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267453}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025174.981385, "message": "agreed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267455}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025199.8484011, "message": "okay, let's end this", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267457}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025287.8155119, "message": "https://gist.github.com/c36a18870a9a670272bf", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267478}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023275.6825919, "message": "I think it should", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267054}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023560.2549801, "message": "\"I'm editing a section, why is talking about entries?\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267123}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025108.746109, "message": "Makes sense to me", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267445}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025209.265106, "message": "I'll whip up a summary as soon as i can", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267460}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025296.445478, "message": "unrelated to Versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267481}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025394.400991, "message": "neat", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267515}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025422.5154121, "message": "night all!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267524}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023126.493937, "message": "nice", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267026}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023295.8537221, "message": "If you version into the title field in the db, it;s gone", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267059}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023407.7420111, "message": "partial rollback with a warning?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267087}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023416.234035, "message": "Which is what EV would do", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267089}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023473.2978101, "message": "it's a lot of messy work", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267103}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024531.8944809, "message": "upload field will need to understand the concept of entry versions and keep backups accordingly", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267327}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025121.811002, "message": "yep", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267447}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023265.246707, "message": "Does it void the previous versions?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267049}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023280.7151141, "message": "Otherwise we sort of have to tie entries to a section version too", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267057}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023799.6113739, "message": "2) I think perhaps not in the core, but we should definitely keep it in mind so that an extension can easily add/extend the versioning", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267168}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024327.7337241, "message": "In git if you checkout and older commit and then commit again you become in this detached head state", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267280}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024364.2351689, "message": "A version column in the Upload field goes some way", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267291}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024629.392967, "message": "yeah because as a developer I might have uploads fields that i want versioned, and ones that I don't", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267351}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024653.1797631, "message": "World hunger", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267359}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025021.976985, "message": "right, from a system perspective, I guess it's looking at an entry and figuring out what are the aspects of that entry of which it needs to be aware to do its job. So version might be one, visibility or stateness might be one, does language need to be one, etc", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267432}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023467.7597899, "message": "hm", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267102}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023527.5719221, "message": "We could simply state on the section editor that if the structure changes (and there are existing entries) that their version control won't include the old fields.", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267112}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023554.8220849, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267122}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023599.910692, "message": "sure", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267128}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024011.461334, "message": "hehe", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267207}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024180.9239669, "message": "But your moderation extension has access to change that value", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267250}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024230.074991, "message": "Yep", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267263}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024424.9761181, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267305}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024463.0580449, "message": "what are other fields that would have similar issues wrt versioning?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267309}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024679.156949, "message": "next", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267366}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025322.8513949, "message": "ttfn", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267488}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025340.6987121, "message": "ok let's chat offline or in the data formats topic", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267499}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023357.50965, "message": "So you could perform a \"partial\" rollback", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267078}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023529.380285, "message": "I like that approach", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267113}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023708.2922699, "message": "1. If this goes into the core, we could add this version column to each field's table. Would we also want to add a language column to the same effect?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267149}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023990.988205, "message": "Agreed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267201}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024108.3564639, "message": "sure, I take no exception to that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267229}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024271.8430829, "message": "Version 4", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267272}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024288.4265821, "message": "That's how all the cool kids do it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267275}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024508.432023, "message": "an entry that 'belongs to' this one", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267324}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024525.2820649, "message": "so uploads fields would use the API to version the files", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267326}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024706.5707541, "message": "there's a chat scheduled for multilingual already, but nothing for this sort of question", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267376}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024745.875761, "message": "But it's whether this is core or not", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267381}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023639.6825709, "message": "and then I guess it could offer the Entry as CSV/XML whatever", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267135}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023779.405776, "message": "I think we can solve the language problem differently without the need for an additional table column", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267166}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023805.8278799, "message": "Because in my head I had cleanly solved both problems with those columns :P", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267170}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024080.5459039, "message": "so version in core, with enhancement", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267219}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024248.1696711, "message": "Will do that another time", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267267}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024273.8804979, "message": "4", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267273}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024298.573658, "message": "Isn't that how SVN works?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267276}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023411.5608661, "message": "I think just the fields it has data for", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267088}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023488.2552121, "message": "I don't think so", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267105}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023521.9360559, "message": "I think it's reasonable to think that if it's been deleted, then there's not point pulling data in for a non existant field", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267110}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023632.5574341, "message": "Or... if you delete a field and save the section editor (i.e. you \"dirty\" the form), a confirm dialogue that this will also remove the data for previous entry versions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267132}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023665.270534, "message": "@allen yup", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267141}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024235.167727, "message": "So here's an interesting case", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267265}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023417.375216, "message": "the warning has a link to download the full entry?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267090}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023543.6899891, "message": "the context could be a bit weird there though", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267117}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023544.1040609, "message": "Which I think is fair. If you were able to roll back to an existing structure from within the entry publish area, that's akin to making structural changes to sections from within an entry edit form!", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267118}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023587.9312761, "message": "Agree with Brendan though, the notice should just be when you're trying to roll to a version with a diff structure", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267126}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023824.009227, "message": "it has not", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267175}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023885.672241, "message": "Whereas my worry is that existing language extensions are messy and require nasty hacks for other extensions to work with them :P", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267185}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023967.533464, "message": "@brend0 Mediathek -> SSM being one I guess", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267198}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023999.8712699, "message": "You want to pass that by Rowan?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267204}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024015.2999671, "message": "Always one-upping us", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267209}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024031.793596, "message": "Oh I meant just extensions as in, add the concept of a published/moderation/draft state on top of versions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267212}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024040.700094, "message": "He likes his \"advanced\" prefix to all his extensions", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267213}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024069.4991879, "message": "right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267218}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024123.2805541, "message": "But that means there needs to be delegates whenever entry data is queried", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267233}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024149.6510079, "message": "If there was a \"current_version\" or \"published_version\" in tbl_entries, which extensions then modify", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267240}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024202.8417439, "message": "so... Entry versioning in core, using Nick's column idea, with all data being kept in the DB and indexed, and the code littered with delegates so the system could be pimped if need be?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267257}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024244.5829279, "message": "I'd like to write down my suggestion in db schema form to see if others agree", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267266}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024259.8959739, "message": "Cool", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267270}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023683.9797211, "message": "@nickdunn I'd tend to just leave it without", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267144}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307023762.033963, "message": "1) I think we should decide that in the language chat, but for this chat, a version column would be added to the entries table", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267162}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024590.6443131, "message": "sounds about right", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267345}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024610.9208419, "message": "I'm good with that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267349}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024737.743119, "message": "Moderation in my opinion can be solved by a \"state\" column in tbl_entries", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267379}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024789.568784, "message": "Until an extension exposes a \"draft\" concept, or a \"pending\" or \"declined\" concept", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267386}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024263.517113, "message": "What if I had Version 3, rollback to Version 1, then saved another major edit, does that become Version 4? Or does it replace Version 2?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267271}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025202.465807, "message": "thanks all", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267459}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025212.3888559, "message": "Thanks dudes", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267461}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024342.8952639, "message": "and then you have to create a branch of it so that you can merge it back in", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267283}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024837.268223, "message": "are we done here?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267400}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024873.8990309, "message": "I just know doing this with delegates is a pain in the arse", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267412}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025302.2751989, "message": "but I thought more about Data Formats craig", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267482}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024364.0076561, "message": "I'm pretty sure SVN saves it as a new version state", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267290}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024374.7568679, "message": "But not if the file itself changes and is removed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267293}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024774.0545731, "message": "i.e. all versions are \"published\"", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267384}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024812.0354741, "message": "I don't mind that", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267394}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024866.463413, "message": "i think we just take care while building the core to allow for it", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267409}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024866.6675899, "message": "Yeah, agreed", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267410}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024498.2576389, "message": "well relationships are similar", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267319}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024687.0503521, "message": "well we need to figure out whether this moderation question is close enough to versioning that we should sort it here, or whether it's a extension-only problem", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267370}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024907.6201401, "message": "So some generic concept of state-ness that extensions can expose if they wish", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267417}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024583.1314521, "message": "Which is relatively few", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267341}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024639.1103699, "message": "bam bam bam. Solving shit left and right. What's next?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267353}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024816.8023269, "message": "yeah, fine with me", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267395}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024828.1692231, "message": "cool", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267398}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024849.3994279, "message": "but then governments would just love that shit", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267402}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307024850.949218, "message": "yeah me too", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267405}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025144.0975721, "message": "I think 'rolling back' where it can is an elegant solution tbh", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267450}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025248.355334, "message": "Hang a sec", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267464}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025258.5491519, "message": "(pasting to gist)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267468}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025306.84764, "message": "enjoy", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267483}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025355.8495381, "message": "tomorrow? I'm off to bed :)", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267506}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025362.368856, "message": "That gist is just a summary of my thoughts atm", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267508}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025402.8180101, "message": "I might join in on the fun", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267516}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025154.5124619, "message": "I just realised it's 12:30", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267452}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025429.5208509, "message": "sure, thanks", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267526}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025074.3440051, "message": "but anything that the system doesn't need to know about an entry could I guess be extensionized", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267439}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025075.8200741, "message": "?", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267440}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025139.5459249, "message": "Sorry guys, I need to head off soon", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267448}, {"user_id": 7384, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025199.8793061, "message": "yeah need to get back to the job hunt", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267458}, {"user_id": 23057, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025320.266402, "message": "thanks", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267487}, {"user_id": 27420, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307025375.015835, "message": "just was jotting it down", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267512}, {"user_id": 23210, "stars": [], "topic_id": 37809, "date_created": 1307026673.364399, "message": "My notes: https://gist.github.com/1004597", "group_id": 8448, "id": 1267774}] |