convore.json/groups/nodejs-7/node-support-for-other-engines-spidermonkey-rhino-etc/messages.json

[{"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967418.7723141, "message": "I'm still learning about the infrastructure of node when I can.  But it seems to me that there is a higher level js api around \"bindings\".", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336870}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967716.147016, "message": "sure", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336917}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967557.364502, "message": "but you should keep in mind that both node native parts and native parts of various modules extensively use V8 API --- so they either need to be rewritten to use some kind of abstraction layer.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336893}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967722.493845, "message": "but it sounds like you don't think it's worth it?", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336919}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967434.9934289, "message": "and those bindings could conceivably be implemented with another js vm", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336872}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967302.4471741, "message": "http://twitter.com/#!/polotek/status/46685291171414016", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336851}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967740.4118309, "message": "I think if node could spread to other engines it would gain critical mass much more quickly", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336921}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967484.1790831, "message": "yes of course it is doable.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336881}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968831.91187, "message": "indeed. excited about it", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337139}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967917.977145, "message": "also, it seems backwards to change or add things at the lower level (engine), rather than adapting the higher level system (node).", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336965}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967992.838165, "message": "The investment should be made now to adapt it for multiple engines", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336983}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967945.2702241, "message": "so rhino wants to support node it also needs a v8 shim? nitro?", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336971}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967974.7223599, "message": "I'm of the opinion that node is still new enough to change", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336978}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299967978.1168971, "message": "but soon it won't be", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336979}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968014.7367251, "message": "later, when it becomes obvious that this is what should happen, it will be much less possible", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336987}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968061.0684409, "message": "this \"critical mass\" will be seriously fragmented. SM supports a lot of non-standard language extensions, rhino runs on top of Java platform, etc. --- this might give rise to a lot of incompatible modules. and frankly speaking I don't see any pros from adapting it to all different VMs.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 336996}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968121.2497211, "message": "no pros? there are people who have already invested in these other VMs. node might fit nicely into their infrastructure if it ran on the same platform", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337010}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968141.411783, "message": "it's interesting to me because I want to see yet another performance comparison between V8 and SM (and any other JS engine) but I doubt that nodejs/nodejs community as whole  will benefit from it.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337013}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968847.8659129, "message": "thanks for chatting. I'm off. would like to get others to weigh in here.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337141}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968183.001677, "message": "I think right now node is being used in a narrow niche. realtime, and high throughput i/o for web servers", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337026}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968196.536911, "message": "but there is more out there it can be great at", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337035}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968389.0022309, "message": "because there is no compelling alternative", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337076}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968452.254925, "message": "but things can always change", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337096}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968184.7596941, "message": "which is great", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337028}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968319.0140679, "message": "I also feel like a system with the potentially widespread popularity of node could do a lot to discourage engine makers from continuing to push these extensions", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337063}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968418.0919199, "message": "and as it becomes more viable, it can be used as leverage to drive direction for browser makers", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337083}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968225.624861, "message": "I agree about the fragmenting", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337039}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968242.2546, "message": "but I think that's somewhat inevitable anyway because people also want interoperability with the browser", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337044}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968342.040338, "message": "if people stop using them because there is a compelling reason to be compatible across engines", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337067}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968269.969847, "message": "I think the node community has had good success educating people about what they need to do to keep their modules compatible", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337049}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968340.0565431, "message": "I doubt.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337065}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968366.307611, "message": "engine makers make their engines for browsers.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337071}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968349.462024, "message": "then they lose the incentive", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337068}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968397.271199, "message": "I think node is the start of that alternative", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337079}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968377.0792999, "message": "right now they do :)", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337074}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968440.1545761, "message": "my position is a little far looking perhaps", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337088}, {"user_id": 2630, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968459.2391739, "message": "and designing for change is always good right :)", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337098}, {"user_id": 21082, "stars": [{"date_created": 1300166771.9705701, "user_id": 561}], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1299968583.8811531, "message": "well. nodemonkey will show us whether having two engines under the hood is good or bad :-)", "group_id": 4812, "id": 337114}, {"user_id": 561, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1300166649.614325, "message": "nice discussion. I'm checking out nodemonkey.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 353579}, {"user_id": 396, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1300999147.5549369, "message": "I think it's a great idea, and sort of what I was trying to do with narwhal and CommonJS, but that stuff needs to be \"rebooted\" in a post-Node world", "group_id": 4812, "id": 430825}, {"user_id": 20907, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1301035187.8796589, "message": "As one of the people who started the nodemonkey project (now going as spidernode), I'll say that we wanted to do something that would have as much chance of being taken into Node.js itself, so we're working on implementing the V8 API on top of SM.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 436321}, {"user_id": 20907, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1301035312.4899549, "message": "The alternative was to rewrite Node to use the JavaScriptCore (Safari) API since V8 already has bindings for that (that's how that whole WebKit integration works). But a quick assessment there showed that JSC stuff was tied pretty closely to webkit, and we didn't want to go down that road.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 436325}, {"user_id": 20907, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1301035946.3522699, "message": "So that said, our priority so far has been to get the V8 shim working (https://github.com/zpao/v8monkey), then move on to plugging that into Node (https://github.com/zpao/spidernode). We're working on getting both of those into states where people can easily hack & contribute.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 436357}, {"user_id": 20907, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1301035965.7755949, "message": "So that said, our priority so far has been to get the V8 shim working (https://github.com/zpao/v8monkey), then move on to plugging that into Node (https://github.com/zpao/spidernode). We're working on getting both of those into states where people can easily hack & contribute.", "group_id": 4812, "id": 436358}, {"user_id": 32565, "stars": [], "topic_id": 12706, "date_created": 1304814453.1105809, "message": "anyone doing this on Nitro? -- @jchris", "group_id": 4812, "id": 954634}]